Submitted by: Damagosha Dasa
Below is this conversation/Interview Srila Prabhupada explains that to the person who is qualified, who can speak directly, not figuratively with God-he is guru. There are two points for disciplic succession-be ordered and be qualified. Srila Prabhupada never gave any order for any of his disciples to take up the process of taking disciples in their own name, within his institution, but for us to initiate on his behalf only.
He also mentions several other points as well in this telling conversation. How much he sleeps,how far ahead he is of publishing his books than this disciples, how we the disciples cannot keep with our Spiritual Master,how he will choose a successor etc…
Hare Krsna
damaghosa das
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Interview NY July 14 1976
Interviewer: How many centers in the United States?
Prabhupāda: About forty.
Rāmeśvara: Forty or fifty.
Hari-śauri: Fifty with the farms.
Interviewer: How are those supported? Do they support themselves?
Prabhupāda: That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Interviewer: I beg your pardon?
Prabhupāda: That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Interviewer: The way they support themselves?
Prabhupāda: Yes, Kṛṣṇa supports.
Interviewer: Kṛṣṇa supports?
Prabhupāda: Yes. We do not know what we shall eat tomorrow, but we have no insufficiency. Rather, neighbors they are grudging that these people do not do anything and they live so comfortably. Sometimes they ask…
Interviewer: How does Kṛṣṇa support them?
Prabhupāda: That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Interviewer: He mediates through physical things, does he?
Prabhupāda: Everything belongs to Kṛṣṇa.
Interviewer: Yes.
Prabhupāda: So Kṛṣṇa is within you. So if Kṛṣṇa dictates, “Give him three thousand dollars,” you’ll give me. That’s all. That actually it is fact. Yesterday Mr. Coleman came? He gave me a check for three thousand. I never asked him.
Bali-mardana: Who? Mr. Coleman?
Hari-śauri: Coleman.
Prabhupāda: So we are immediately depositing for our Vṛndāvana and Māyāpura scheme. So Kṛṣṇa sends money. We do not bother what will happen tomorrow. But we are very nicely maintained by Kṛṣṇa’s grace. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness
Interviewer: They still have to go out and ask occasionally?
Bali-mardana: It’s not that we sit back and wait for Kṛṣṇa to send it to us.
Rāmeśvara: No, we’re very industrious.
Prabhupāda: We don’t sit down idly.
Bali-mardana: God helps those who help themselves.
Prabhupāda: We are not idle preachers, we are working. All, very hard, more than the karmīs.
Rāmeśvara: These men, they go out to engage people in taking our books maybe twelve hours a day sometimes, ten hours a day, without any salary.
Prabhupāda: I am now eighty years old, I am working twenty-four hours. I think I work more than my young disciples (laughter).
Bali-mardana: Oh yes, definitely.
Prabhupāda: I work at night.
Rāmeśvara: It is hard to keep up with Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Hari-śauri: Very difficult.
Prabhupāda: We are not idle creatures.
Rāmeśvara: We are publishing his books and sometimes he is ahead of us by seventeen volumes.
Hari-śauri: In the evening Śrīla Prabhupāda goes to bed at ten o’clock and gets up at eleven-thirty to begin translating.
Interviewer: You just sleep a couple of hours, then?
Prabhupāda: No, one and a half hour.
Interviewer: That’s it?
Prabhupāda: Yes. Of course in daytime I take rest two hours. So in this way altogether about three to four hours. Our philosophy is not that you sit idly and God will send everything, no, not like that. We know God will send everything, still we work. Without God’s sanction nothing can come. But we must be qualified to receive the favor of God. That is our philosophy.
Interviewer: Are you surprised at the way this organization has prospered?
Prabhupāda: What do you mean?
Hari-śauri: Are we surprised at the way the movement has expanded and prospered in just a few short years.
Prabhupāda: No, it is not surprising, it is natural. If you do, just like if you do business in proper way there will be profit. Similarly, as it is enjoined in this book of knowledge, if you do like that it will expand, it will prosper. Two plus two equal to four. Mathematical calculation. If you make two plus two, it will become four. It will neither become three nor five. So here it is said, you have read the, that “One who is engaged twenty-four hours in My service, so I, yoga-kṣemaṁ vahāmy aham [Bg. 9.22], I supply whatever he requires and I protect whatever he has got.” So if you actually serve Kṛṣṇa, then everything you want, it will come.
Interviewer: Are you the one who chooses who runs each center, who is responsible in each temple.
Prabhupāda: Yes. Our program is to open centers in every village, every town, to propagate Kṛṣṇa consciousness.
Interviewer: And you choose the leaders, or Kṛṣṇa does and tells you, how does that work?
Prabhupāda: No, I have been chosen by my spiritual master.
Interviewer: Yes. And you in turn choose others?
Prabhupāda: Oh yes. That is our succession.
Interviewer: On what basis?
Prabhupāda: Basis, on the order of Kṛṣṇa. Originally the order is from Kṛṣṇa.
Interviewer: How does that come?
Prabhupāda: Comes by disciplic succession. Just like Kṛṣṇa said this knowledge to Arjuna and Arjuna said to others and it is open. Everyone can take it, there is no secrecy. We have to accept only, that’s all.
Interviewer: I missed that, I’m sorry.
Prabhupāda: The order is already there, it is open, open secret. There is no secrecy. Anyone can take it.
Interviewer: All right. But in terms of specific, say, choosing, specific things, specific details.
Prabhupāda: Yes, in all details, how to become Kṛṣṇa conscious, there is all details in this book, Bhagavad-gītā As It Is.
Hari-śauri: So he’s asking what’s a man’s qualification to be chosen.
Rāmeśvara: In other words Prabhupāda will decide who should be leader if he’s qualified and there’s a process for making him qualified and there’s a process for testing to see if he is qualified. So in that way it all comes from Kṛṣṇa.
Interviewer: You chose, for example, these fellows here to run the publishing house and be responsible for the east coast.
Prabhupāda: Yes, like that. He’s in charge of publication, he’s in charge something else, he’s charge, like that.
Interviewer: On what basis, though, can you tell me some of the things that…
Prabhupāda: Basis, just to see whether he’s qualified, that’s all. Just like ordinarily one manager is appointed by the superior authority on the merit, on his qualification. That’s all.
Interviewer: Okay, is it a mediated choice or is it a direct communication from Kṛṣṇa, that’s my question.
Prabhupāda: No.
Rāmeśvara: He’s asking whether we claim that God speaks to us directly.
Prabhupāda: Yes, God speaks to you when you are qualified. You cannot expect God as order supplier. When he sees that you are qualified, he will speak to you.
Bali-mardana: The spiritual master is the representative of God to the disciple because he is in direct contact with God.
Prabhupāda: My spiritual master appointed me that “You do this.” Similarly I shall appoint somebody else, this is the way.
Rāmeśvara: It’s difficult for people to understand that God can speak to a man. They question, “How can God speak to some man?”
Prabhupāda: That is, anything, that, the radio message is coming, a foolish man cannot understand how it is coming. He’ll think “How it is that, speaking?” So any foolish man will be astonished how things are happening. That is foolishness. But God says, find out this verse…
Hari-śauri: Four three? Sa evāyaṁ mayā te ‘dya [Bg. 4.3]?
Prabhupāda: Huh? No no. Buddhi-yogaṁ dadāmi taṁ yena mām upayānti te.
Rāmeśvara: Teṣāṁ satata-yuktānām [Bg. 10.10].
Prabhupāda: Ah, teṣāṁ satata-yuktānāṁ bhajatāṁ prīti-pūrvakam [Bg. 10.10].
Hari-śauri: Dadāmi buddhi-yogaṁ taṁ yena mām upayānti te.
Prabhupāda: Ah, yes.
Hari-śauri: “To those who are constantly devoted and worship Me with love, I give them the understanding by which they can come to Me.”
Prabhupāda: God is situated in everyone’s heart. As soon as He sees that “Here is a qualified person,” then He gives him instruction.
Interviewer: But in the same way that Kṛṣṇa says He’ll provide for your needs you still must work to achieve whatever Kṛṣṇa is giving you.
Prabhupāda: Yes. You work for Kṛṣṇa. You have to work to get your necessities.
Interviewer: In the same way I’m curious with respect to the way Kṛṣṇa communicates with you, whether it’s in a similar kind of way that He gives you your necessities.
Bali-mardana: In other words, when you decide that someone is to be in charge of a particular temple does Kṛṣṇa tell you that this person should be in charge.
Interviewer: Or do you by judging him say this person is qualified.
Prabhupāda: Yes, because a devotee always consults Kṛṣṇa and He gives order.
Interviewer: It’s a more direct communication.
Prabhupāda: Yes. And He gives order.
Rāmeśvara: Because intelligence, our philosophy is that intelligence comes from Kṛṣṇa. So if I have some…
Interviewer: And your philosophy is that your daily necessities come from Kṛṣṇa as well.
Rāmeśvara: Yes, try to understand. Suppose my intelligence sees that this person is qualified, that means Kṛṣṇa has told me.
Prabhupāda: No, not necessarily, Kṛṣṇa will tell directly. A devotee always consults Kṛṣṇa and Kṛṣṇa tells him, “Do like this.” Not figuratively.
Interviewer: Does that apply then to other kinds of decisions and other kinds of activities as well?
Prabhupāda: Everything. Because a devotee does not do anything without consulting Kṛṣṇa.
Bali-mardana: But that applies to a very greatly elevated soul, that is not an ordinary person.
Prabhupāda: That is, therefore the minor devotees, they consult the spiritual master. That is our process. Yasya prasādād bhagavat-prasādaḥ **.
Rāmeśvara: I see, I was trying to explain the minor devotees.
Interviewer: No, I was talking about…
Rāmeśvara: You’re talking about the topmost level.
Interviewer: Yes.
Bali-mardana: He’s getting right to the source.(laughter) Right to the top.
Interviewer: That will do it for me, I thank you, kindly.
