Prabhupāda: No mistake, no illusion, no cheating, no imperfection. Anyone who commits mistake, he’s illusioned, he’s a cheater and imperfect—he cannot lead. So bring any leader of these rascal groups and test with these four principles; he is misleader.
Trivikrama: They’re all servants of their senses.
Madhudviṣa: They will also say that within our movement the so-called leaders also have imperfections.
Prabhupāda: Eh?
Madhudviṣa: They will say, within our movement, that the leaders also have imperfection.
Prabhupāda: No imperfection.
Trivikrama: No imperfection.
Madhudviṣa: They will say, “Yes, we can give you examples.”
Prabhupāda: No. No, no. Why? Why you shall accept? They will say. Because therefore they are saying, we shall accept?
Prabhupāda: Yes, this is test of.
Madhudviṣa: They will say, “He is also makes mistakes.”
Prabhupāda: No, there is no mistake.
Gurudāsa: Where is the mistake?
Prabhupāda: There is no mistake.
Gurudāsa: Jaya.
Prabhupāda: Hm.
Prabhupāda: If you think your leader is mistaken, then you are mistaken. (laughter)
Mahendra: Like a mirror. You see a mistake but it’s yourself.
Prabhupāda: The leader of mistake-therefore immediately gives evidence from śāstra. What is the use of quoting from the śāstra? “Just to prove that I am not mistaken, here is the proof.”
Madhudviṣa: They would say that there is a way of life which is perfect, but all men are imperfect. There is a way of life.
Prabhupāda: Yes, therefore they… Because you are imperfect, therefore you have to accept the leadership of a perfect person.
Madhudviṣa: They will say no one is perfect.
Prabhupāda: No, that is the… That is your ignorance.
Prabhupāda: Now, just like blind man says, “Nobody is with eyes. Because I am blind, so everyone is blind.” Ātmavat manyate jagat.
Devotee: Śrīla Prabhupāda, the whole thing is actually nonsense because Marx himself in his old age became senile and died in a crazy condition.
Prabhupāda: Yes, he must be. He was crazy always. Many, many leaders die like that.
Trivikrama: Every leader.
Madhudviṣa: They will point out that our ācāryas also died. You say that Marx died, so they will say, “Your ācāryas also died.”
Prabhupāda: Dying, that… There is difference of dying. But nobody, he died… They did not die a crazy. That is the superexcellence.(of our acaryas)
Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So now you’ve defined a perfect leader. What is a perfect system? What are the criterion for a perfect system?
Prabhupāda: Perfect system means from which we do not suffer. That’s all.
Prabhupāda: No suffering.
Prabhupāda: Yes. We are always hankering after happiness. So we do not like suffering.So if there is no suffering, that is perfect system.
Prabhupāda: It is always existing.
Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa
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Conclusions–
This is a very nice conversation in which Srila Prabhupada explains that the real
leaders, the real acaryas, not the fake ones we see everywhere today, these real leaders make no mistakes, are not in illusions, dont have imperfect senses and do not cheat others in any way. Otherwise if they dont possess these qualifications, how can they be real leaders? If somebody is blind, how can he lead others? To lead under these conditions means only cheating others. Srila Prabhupada is not such a cheater. If one thinks the real acarya is mistaken, then he is a mistake, not the acarya ! This platform of super excellence cannot even by conceived by a conditioned soul, nor recognized even when seen. Here is the proof-—
SB 4.18.5 A foolish person who manufactureshis own ways and means through mental speculation and does not recognize the authority of the sages who lay down unimpeachable directions is simply unsuccessful again and again in his attempts.
PURPORT
At the present moment it has become fashionable to disobey the unimpeachable directions given by the ācāryas and liberated souls of the past.Presently people are so fallen